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it´s ok to bowl like a girl
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blackcloud




Joined: Jul 04, 2005
Posts: 139
Location: las vegas, NV / gapan, nueva ecija

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 3:38 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

one of the disadvantages is that they don´t have the strength to throw a ball that massively hooks from gutter to gutter. so what do they do? they rely on accuracy. they try to keep things simple. and they will rely on finesse and let the ball do the rest.
now us guys like that big booming hook. maybe you young guys on the forum do but when you get older, that power diminishes as time goes on. perfect example is mark roth. last time i saw him bowl, he was not the same as he was during his prime, the big booming hook with a plastic ball. yes a plastic ball. today his backswing is much lower, takes fewer steps to the foul line and let´s the ball do it´s job. another bowler, ernie schelegel...the iron man of the PBA. he wasn´t called the iron man for nothing. over 700 tournaments from the late 60´s up to today. he bowls part time now. but he can still bowl with the young guys. just your basic down and in bowler. moves when needed. strokes the ball like he did when he first started.
guys like tim mack will have to change their game sooner or later. the girls, they keep bowling the same way they do. less is more; accuracy is a necessity; keep things simple.
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blackcloud




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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 3:40 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

OK boys let´s hear it. debate is now on.
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dabesbowlerindapilipins




Joined: Nov 18, 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 5:43 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

if you want to throw like a girl, it´s fine with me.
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blackcloud




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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 10:58 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

dabes,
this post is aimed towards beginners who are starting out and not towards advanced bowlers who post here like you. there is an article regarding this subject in the USBC magazine, US Bowler. i´m just sharing what i just read and posted it here for our intermediate bowlers who run into this forum.
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Jorge




Joined: Aug 07, 2005
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Location: Philam Homes, QCMM

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 6:07 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

Dabes -

I think that we should not discriminate against the weaker sex. We can learn a thing or two from them. We are stronger than ladies but knocking down the pins is not always solved by high ball speed and lots of spin.

Earl Anthony, mentioned by Black Cloud, was known for finesse. He threw the ball just hard enough to knock down the pins. I saw him play on TV several times in the ´80´s and I would think his ball speed is less than mine. Yet he won a lot of titles, is a Hall of Famer, and as mentioned in a different forum topic, a runner up and winner in two senior events coming out of retirement.

It would be better to slow down and put the ball in the pocket every time than be powerful and miss it half the time. My wife uses a ten pound PLASTIC ball, throws it with a good size hook at just under 3 seconds, and can put it in the pocket more often and more consistently than I can. She strikes better Brooklyn, but usually leaves the # 5 pin due to the light ball on a pocket hit. She gets better scores than I can most of the time, as I have yet to sort out my own game. Bottom line here is that she is more accurate with less power.

There is a husband/wife tandem from Philam who play in Playdium and have PBC listed averages. They are about the same age range as us, both right handed. The guy has an average of just under 160 but the girl has a higher average of about 166. I have seen them play. The guy throws with a moderate speed and consequently a big hook, but the girl throws a very mild REVERSE HOOK !!!

I have always believed that bowling is a game of consistency, regardless of style. You can do it any way you can, two handed (yes, I saw someone on ESPN do that !!!), wrong footed (there are a few I have seen), helicopter style (insulting/frustrating for hook bowlers like us, I think) , etc., provided you throw the ball the same way every time. Of course, power with accuracy is a plus. I do not contest this. But wild power gets us nowhere. At least for accuracy, the girls can teach us a thing or two. Hope this helps.





[ This message was edited by: Jorge on 2005-08-28 03:22 ]


Jaws
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dabesbowlerindapilipins




Joined: Nov 18, 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 12:48 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

jorge,

bowling isn´t about gender, size and age. as long as you can repeat shots and be accurate, there will be a good chance that your average will be high. i also think that you cannot associate gender with accuracy and power. there is no direct relationship between gender and accuracy.
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blackcloud




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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 1:10 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

dabes,
i agree with what you are saying. but what i´m trying to point here is that if you watch some of the better female bowlers. there can be some things we can pick up from them. the female bowlers of today, thanks to technology
will sooner or later catch up with the men. liz johnson came very close to winning PBA national title. she did win a sattelite two weeks ago.
if i put a plastic ball in your hand and had you bowl on a freshly oiled x´mas tree pattern. you would have to drastically change your speed and rely on complete accuracy to average par. that´s where the saying "it´s ok to bowl like a girl" comes into play.
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dabesbowlerindapilipins




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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 3:31 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

if you put a plastic ball on my hand, there is a chance that i´d still hit par. maybe it will still hook... or maybe i dont have to play the hook... bottomline is you need a good ball sense for that. ball speed manipulation is an advanced technique. i do not recommend it for beginners.
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blackcloud




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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:48 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

sorry da bes but i have to disagree with that. i have had the opprtunity to
teach some beginners and help rework some games of some of the jr bowlers in portland. i always emphasized to the beginners that "slow is fast". therefore the "it´s ok to bowl like a girl " works in this situation. but i also emphasize that everything will come naturally after awhile. the whole idea is to start them throwing the right way. with he jrs. i had them slow it down to a point to where the ball will just roll off their hands. much like what david ozio does. result?? averages went up . if you are going to teach a beginner, they might as well start on the right track. "it´s hard to teach an old dog new tricks "
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Angelo




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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:56 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

for me it depends on what kind of lane condition you are playing, i am playing in SM North where lanes are conditioned and have a hgh scoring lane condition, i bowl hook - if i throw it straight and simple, i couldnt carry, i get weak pins but if i lift and rotate the ball with power, i score better, in SM Fairview, where lanes are shitty and no backends at all, if i hook the ball with full lift and turn, my average would drop 30 pins unlike the very simple bowlers, seniors who bowl 10-10 angle, they could easily beat me....
regarding in gender.... oh maybe in a stepladder match there is no advantage for men but maybe in long games, men would be better...thats why a lot of tournaments here...girls have a higher handicap....thats my opinion mga boss...



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Jorge




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Location: Philam Homes, QCMM

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:38 am  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

Coach -

Clarification lang. I have played both in SM North and SM Mega. Aside from scratching my balls, they both seem fast for wooden lanes. Minsan inabutan ko ang SM North na super slow, but SM Mega was always fast. Syempre I said this because puro plastic ang mga bola kong ginagamit sa wood lanes, per your advice - sayang ang reactives.

About SM Fairview, wood din yun, so I am not too hot about playing there (malayo pa). What are those lanes like ? Slow or fast ? What do you mean by "no backend". Just curious in case I happen to go bowling lane hopping and end up playing there one day.



[ This message was edited by: Jorge on 2005-08-29 11:41 ]

[ This message was edited by: Jorge on 2005-08-29 11:42 ]


Jaws
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dabesbowlerindapilipins




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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 3:15 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

jorge,

allow me to answer the "no backend" stuff. as our great former pbc official will say, it means the 15 foot part of the lane after the "pines" area is missing and your ball will not reach the pins hehehehehehehe!

seriously, it means the backend is not bone dry.


[ This message was edited by: dabesbowlerindapilipins on 2005-08-31 11:38 ]
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mark300




Joined: Aug 14, 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 3:40 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

well for me whatever works for you go and do it but wait what do you mean by "bowl like a girl" how do you do that?

For me mukhang maguguluhan lang buhay mo why not start from what you are doing right now and correct the mistakes na lang...pagtagal din you will go back to your original shot and be frustrated again...diba? think about it


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mark300




Joined: Aug 14, 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 3:48 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

jorge: well yung turo sa amin before lalo na when you encounter such lanes lalo na pag mga tournaments sa labas ng metro manila is to bring a strong and weak ball or yun pinaka-weakest mo lalo na pag wood ang lalaruan for example sa ilo-ilo wow paiyakan dun ask frank, angelo and the other bowlers na nakaexperience ng tournament dun grabe! iuntog mo talaga ang ulo mo sa gulo ng lanes...siguro kulang lang talaga din ako sa diskarte at swerte na din...well like you guys said you need LUCK din when you play bowling...GOOD DAY


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"WE RIDE TOGETHER...WE DIE TOGETHER...BADBOYS FOR LIFE!"
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blackcloud




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 11:43 pm  Post subject: it´s ok to bowl like a girl Reply with quote

what i meant was there are some things that female bowlers (and that´s the better ones) do than the men. slow is fast, less is more, and pinpoint accuracy.
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